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From: "sarbajit roy" <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2010 11:42 PM
To: "INDIA RTI for empowerment" <rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [rti4empowerment] Re: Poll results for rti4empowerment
> Dear Mr WEDS
>
> From your name it appears that you are one of those foreign financed
> Christian Evangelists so notorious for deceiving innocent people.
>
> Unfortunately your post is too long, confused and badly structured.
> Your arguments against God are incoherent, rambling logically
> inconsistent, and frankly ignorant of Hindu religion. No rational
> person can share your beliefs. I am a rational person and also believe
> in God, or GOD. I find no inconsistency in my position.
>
> Let me set out a few of my core beliefs. These are basically as
> published in English by Raj Narain Bose in about 1873. Raj Narain Bose
> was the man who framed the concept of 'Hindutva', and was also
> grandfather of Shri Aurobindo.
>
> 1) God is One without a second. "Ekamevadwiteeyam" One Supreme God— "a
> God, endowed with a distinct personality & moral attributes equal to
> His nature, and intelligence befitting the Governor of the
> Universe," (We do not believe in His incarnations).
>
> 2) God has no name, no form, no limit. It is impossible to make an
> idol of "him". God can be sensed through intuition in the the book of
> nature.
>
> 3) To worship "him" is to love / adore him and do the things he loves
>
> 4) Worship of "him" needs no fixed place or time. "We can adore Him at
> any time and at any place, provided that time and that place are
> calculated to compose and direct the mind towards Him." There is no
> need for gurus, or priests to conduct worship.
>
> 5) Do not perform any rites or ceremonies, or believe in penances, as
> instrumental in obtaining the grace of God. We declare that moral
> righteousness, the gaining of wisdom, Divine contemplation, charity
> and the cultivation of devotional feelings, are our rites and
> ceremonies. We further say, govern and regulate your feelings,
> discharge your duties to God and to man, and you will gain everlasting
> blessedness, purify your heart, cultivate devotional feelings, and you
> will see Him who is Unseen.
>
> 6) Theoretically, there is no distinction of caste. We declare that we
> are all the part of God, and, therefore, must consider ourselves as
> one.
>
> 7) There are no places like heaven or hell.
>
> 8) There is no "soul".
>
> This BTW is pure classical Vedic "Hinduism" and not that corrupt form
> which passes for Hinduism today among the popular classes and allows
> foreigners to abuse and parody the supposed 33,000 crore godlets and
> their gaudy "worship" perpetuated by false priestly classes.
>
> So before making sweeping assumptions/arguments about what most among
> human beings believe in, please explain why you disagree with
> traditional Indian Vedic beliefs as stated above.
>
> Sarbajit
>
> On Dec 12, 3:37 am, DSouza Wilberious Evanglist
> <wileva...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Every country should have a well defined policy. However, consider scores
>> of
>> Indians who illegally emigrate to USA Europe etc. Even India is formed
>> by
>> illegal immigration from all over the world over the time immemorial.
>>
>> Read this:
>>
>> HAR ZOR ZULLUM KE TAKKAR MEIN, KAAFLE BASTEY GAYE; HINDUSTAAN BANTAA
>> GAYAA!
>>
>> India has accepted with open arms anybody seeking assylum.
>>
>> About "HINDU BIGOT" let us enlighten ourselves that human beings of
>> different
>> ethnicity exist in this world!!! For further enlightenment read the
>> folllowing:
>>
>> -BLIND BELIEF-DOES GOD EXIST??????!!!!!
>>
>> Please ponder over these very rational statements.
>> Most amongst the human beings believe that God exists.
>> For some it is either Brahma, Vishnu or Maheshwar or one of the 399 Gods
>> &
>> Goddesses or scores of spirits & ghosts,
>> For some, it is Jesus Christ,
>> For some it is Allah,
>> For some it is Buddha,
>> For some it is any of Jain Tirtankars,
>> For some any of the Gurus of Sikhism so on & so forth.
>> We quarrel amongst ourselves that we are Hindus, Christians, Sikhs,
>> Muslims,
>> Jains, Buddhists, etc., but, has any God or Goddess revealed himself or
>> herself
>> to any one of us to either endorse our quarrel or decry it? Answer is an
>> emphatic NO!
>> Does any one who dies, return to tell tale about? Answer also is an
>> emphatic NO!
>> Is SWARG or NARAK, JANNAT or JEHANNUM, HEAVEN or HELL a large celestial
>> world?
>> If YES, how much of it is under control of any of these;
>> BRAHMA, VISHNU, MAHESHWAR & 399 GODS & GODDESSES OR ALLAH, JESUS CHRIST,
>> BUDDHA
>> ETC., so on & so forth? There is no answer!
>>
>> If one or some change ones or their faith, which Swarg or Narak, Jannat
>> or
>> Jehnnum, Heaven or Hell that one or those reach? None knows the answer!
>>
>> Do these Gods & Goddesses retain accounting books with them so that those
>> who
>> forsake a faith shall be a debit entry in the forsaken God/Goddess's book
>> and
>> credit entry in embraced God/Goddess's book? None knows the answer!
>>
>> If these Gods/Goddesses are OMNISCIENT, OMNIPOTENT, OMNIPERVADING do they
>> need
>> Temples, Mosques, Churches, Basadis, Gompas, Gurudwaras? Answer obviously
>> is an
>> emphatic NO!
>>
>> If these Gods/Goddesses exist, why Allah did not prevent demolition of
>> Babri
>> Mosque; why did Brahma, Vishnu, Maheswar & other 399 Gods & Goddesses did
>> not
>> prevent the demolition of scores of temples in India & outside after
>> demolition
>> of Babri Mosque? Likewise, why Jesus Christ did not prevent demolition of
>> churches in history? So much so, the Jain Sikh & Buddhist Gods prevent
>> the
>> demolition of the respective places of worships whenever they occurred in
>> the
>> history? E.g. Jain temples in Southern India & Buddhist temples in
>> Northern
>> India WERE converted to Hindu temples in the late second century A.D.
>> when
>> Hinduism usurped trampling Jainism & Buddhism in India ? Any answers?
>> Obviously
>> NO!
>> Is there any evidence of war or quarrel amongst or conquest of any of the
>> Gods &
>> Goddesses by the other? Answer is obviously NO!
>>
>> Followers of various faiths quarrel among themselves & one another
>> without any
>> interference from any of the Gods. Just as in the case of political
>> parties,
>> party leaders do not quarrel but, party workers quarrel for the leaders
>> sustain
>> injuries & losses. What a paradox! Any reasons? Answer is yet again an
>> emphatic
>> NO!
>>
>> Religions are being used just as political parties trying to create vote
>> bank,
>> by Swamis, Mullah's & others, Priests or numerous Godmen & Godwomen
>> prompting
>> their followers to quarrel for them.
>> Why Gods & Goddesses exist only for Human Beings & not for reptiles,
>> birds &
>> Animals? Any answers? Obviously NO!
>> In Punarjanm or Reincarnation, cow is one form of Punarjanm. Visualise a
>> Hindu,
>> A Muslim, a Christian, a Sikh, A Jain, A Buddhist, so on & so forth
>> having a cow
>> each and if these sell their cows amongst themselves; does the cow sold
>> relinquishes worship of God/Goddess of its earlier master/mistress &
>> begin to
>> worship God/Goddess of its new master/mistress? Any answers? Obviously
>> NO!
>> Which of the Gods/Goddesses the scores of birds, reptiles, animals in
>> jungle
>> worship? Any answers? Obviously NO!
>> Human beings in the world speak scores of languages. Why these
>> Gods/Goddesses
>> standardize the languages spoken by their adorers? Any answers? Obviously
>> NO!
>> Sun shines evenly without discrimination upon a Hindu (any sect)
>> Christian (any
>> denomination) Muslim( any denomination) so on & so forth. So does when
>> it
>> rains!
>> A cat mews identically in a house of a Hindu (any sect) Christian (any
>> denomination) Muslim ( any denomination) so on & so forth!
>> A cow yields milk & milk alone regardless whether it is in the house of a
>> Hindu
>> (any sect) Christian ( any denomination) Muslim( any denomination) so on
>> & so
>> forth!
>> So does a dog or any other mammal that is reared!
>>
>> Every Purohit or Bhat, or Priest or Mullah or Sant avers that God always
>> tests a
>> devotee by giving him or her testing times & travails to ensure that
>> he/she is
>> steadfast in his/her devotion and also those who undergo travails &
>> tribulations
>> are ensured happiness in the other world; whereas, to bring the wrongdoer
>> into
>> God's fold God is extra benevolent to him/her! What a paradoxical
>> justice! What
>> is it anyway; nothing but HUMBUG!
>>
>> Every faith propagates that the human beings were created by the creator,
>> The
>> God! In that case why the Gods created Human speaking different
>> languages,
>> different races, skin colour etc.?
>> Why the Gods created Humans with uneven distribution of wealth, intellect
>> &
>> ability?
>> Are so named or called Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, Jains, Christians,
>> Buddhists
>> etc., so on & so forth, denote or connote different ethnic or groups?
>> Answer
>> obviously is No!
>>
>> These are only groups owing allegiance to different schools of thought!
>> Just as
>> political parties!
>>
>> All Gods or Goddesses may at best historical personalities or creation of
>> fertile imagination & nothing else!
>>
>> So, it is futile to build places of worship, e.g. TEMPLES, MOSQUES,
>> CHURCHES,
>> GURUDWARAS, JAIN & BUDDISTS TEMPLES so on & so forth & waste resources in
>> propitiation, votive offerings etc.,
>> All those God-men, God-women, priests, swamis, mullahs etc., exist by
>> profession; only a CRAFT to earn one's livelihood! Just as Sanskrit
>> saying;
>> UDHARA BHARANUM; BAHUKRITA VESHAM!
>>
>>
>> Further, every religion claims that all humans have a soul but, birds,
>> animals,
>> reptiles etc., have none! What a partisan dispensation by the God!!!???
>>
>> "I helped give birth to three children with the human cloningtechnique,
>> known as
>> genetic recoding. It involved two boys and a girl who are nine years old
>> today.
>> They were born healthy and they are in excellent health now." said
>> Severino
>> Antinori, a prominent gynaecologist, to Oggi, an Italian weekly in an
>> interview
>> that appeared on Wednesday, the 4th of February 2009.Do these two boys &
>> one
>> girl who were created by Severino Antinorihave souls???!!! Any
>> answers???!!!
>>
>> In India, recent statistics indicate that about 76% of Indian population
>> subsist
>> by earning just Rs. 25 a day. This population also worships different
>> Gods/Goddesses, align themselves to varied faiths, pray, offer votives,
>> pay
>> obeisance! Alas! None of the Gods/Goddesses have alleviated them from
>> this
>> morass or predicament! So why waste time & spend hard earned money in
>> these
>> futile exercises?
>>
>> India, our motherland is so diverse, linguistically, ethnically and
>> anthropologically with over 4000 languages about over 1600 religious
>> practices
>> and equally large ethnic origins; it can be equated to an extremely
>> large,
>> massively grown tree; in the boughs & branches immigrant birds from far
>> and
>> wide, genetically & specieally very diverse, have perched and built their
>> nests
>> laid eggs in them, incubated them into fledglings which became fully
>> fledged to
>> further the genus. This tree, the mother India has sheltered them and
>> offered
>> them a habitat & continue to do so without any discrimination on genus &
>> specie!
>>
>> Hence, no specie of any genus can claim proprietary right on this tree!
>> Those countrymen & women who on the basis of religion & God, spread
>> hatred,
>> strife, riots, vandalism, loot, unrest, massacre, bloodshed, lawlessness,
>> anarchy, economic halt, shredding human fibre to pieces that cannot be
>> rewoven
>> into a fabric, are responsible for the tears those are shed from the eyes
>> of
>> hapless kith & kins of those who lose their parents, siblings, bread
>> earners
>> with gloom staring in their eyes! Let them think for a while & visualize
>> what
>> would have been their plight had they encountered similar predicament!
>>
>> So, in conclusion, none of the human beings have any choice when they are
>> born;
>> let human beings live as human beings respecting others right to exist,
>> live,
>> pursue a profession, earn livelihood by fair & equitable means, so long
>> as such
>> a behaviour does not cause any harm, injury, loss or consternation to
>> others,
>> coexisting in this world as human beings, in perfect symbiosis.
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> WEDS
>
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